I went to my first home game for three years, this weekend.

I saw us win, which is a bit of a rarity these days, but apart from that I didn’t see much to inspire me or make me think that this team are going places. Well apart from the Championship perhaps.

As I looked around SJP I thought about how things have changed over the past ten years. I won’t list all of the misdemeanors ranging from changing the name of the ground to the disregard for local heroes but I will instead look purely and simply at our league placing.

So, if you will forgive me, here are a few statistics.

Lets start with a topic close to our hearts – relegation.

Since we started in the football league in 1892 we have been relegated 6 times in total – 1934, 1961, 1978, 1989 and then twice under Ashley in 2009 and 2017. So for the statisticians amongst us, that’s a third of our total or 33% of our total relegations have happened under Ashley. And who knows if this season isn’t going to be number seven. Maybe. Maybe not.

Now lets look at our Premier League placings since 1992.

For the purpose of working out the average placing I have used the championship placing as a continuation of the EPL, so for example if we finished top of the championship I would count this as either 21st or 23rd place (the EPL started off with 22 teams).

Since 1992 we have finished 23, 3, 6, 2, 2, 13, 13, 11, 11, 4, 3, 5, 14, 7 and 13. This gives an average placing BA (before Ashley) of 8.6 or 9th.

Since Ashley has taken over, we have finished 12, 18(r), 21, 12, 5, 16, 10, 15, 18(r), 21 and we are currently 13th, giving an average placing of 14.6 or 15th.

So there you have it. Under Ashley there has been no progress.

We have dropped six places on average and judging by what I saw at the weekend, we are going to sail very close to the wind of relegation number three in his eleven years in charge.

So what’s the point of churning out statistics like this?

Well it proves without a shadow of doubt that we are worse off with Mike Ashley.

We have had one good season where we finished 5th but the vast majority of the time we are flirting with relegation.

Time for Mike Ashley to sell up.

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  • Monkseaton Magpies

    As someone pointed out on here the other day our average going back in time is just below 15th so nothing new here. The Keegan years were not the norm and produced a breed of fan called the Johhny the come lately’s whose expectations were that high they helped get rid of Bobby Robson by walking out on mass after we had finished fifth after the Wolves game. For the fans who had watched us in the lower reaches of the second division what has happened under Ashley is the norm if not above what has happened in the late seventies early eighties. The club is up for sale at a reasonable price but it seems no one wants to buy us. When you look at the position Sunderland and Middlesbrough are in I cannot help why they do not show the same hatred to Short and Gibson the Chairmen as this site does to Ashley very strange indeed.

    • Michael Smith

      Rubbish, the Keegan years could have been the norm but they blew it

      • Peter Stabler

        Keegan’s team was all about the brilliant first team, the rest of the club was neglected so in my view it wasn’t sustainable – needed to develop the scouting and youth at the same time.

      • Monkseaton Magpies

        Hall and Shepherd did not have the money to compete with the top six and nor does Ashley. Seems like this new group have not even got the money to buy the club never mind a centre half.

        • TheFatController

          If they don’t have money why are they in the process of buying the club?

          They have loads of money, if they didn’t, why would Ashley invest his time having a curry with Staveley.

          They just won’t pay Ashley top dollar for a yo-yo club (based upon expenditure on players we are always likely to be in the relegation fight, never mid table safety and thus the tv revenues are not guaranteed)

          Given revenue streams dictate the value of a club, and we don’t have guaranteed revenue streams, it’s not worth over £250m without relegation clauses.

        • Guest 2

          LOL, and the current owner had a net spend of just 700k per season up to 2015.
          You were the bloke bubbling how Rafa should have signed Bony – how’s he working out at Swansea and how are they?
          H&S ensured we competed at the top and in Europe. They ensured we have the ground we do now.
          What will your mate, fatso, be remembered for?

          • Kneebotherm8

            Nothing…….

          • Monkseaton Magpies

            I have never mentioned Bony or any other player on here so you got the wrong person. Could do with a goal scoring midfielder but that’s the only signing I would make this January. Ashley will be remembered for cheap addmission and saving us from bankruptcy as the banks were pulling the plug. Also the interest free loan with has saved us one hundred million. Also a great season in Europe and appointing Rafa . I could go on but will leave it at that.

          • Guest 2

            Bollix. You were prattling on here last month about Rafa supposedly wasting money when he could have signed Bony in your opinion. Just like you said you didn’t mind getting relegated if we won the FA Cup.
            Brains of a rocking horse.

    • Rich Lawson

      Gibson is a good owner who has chucked his money at Boro for years and is generally patient,wish he’d been born here instead.

      • Monkseaton Magpies

        To spend more time in the Championship Boro are not going up anytime soon there record is a lot worse than ours .

    • Guest 2

      Another apologist who just loves Fatty. Oi, numb nuts, the club never earned the money that the PL now provides, so you are comparing Skoda’s with Ferrari’s.

  • ghostrider

    Let’s add some more stuff to your list.

    Ashley was a mug and has been a mug. He’s a stretcher of the truth like all business people. He will manipulate to get what he wants, like all business people and his mindset is to make money, like all businessmen.

    The key to anything that is deemed a success or a failure in terms of mass amount is in how much layout any business person is willing to use to gain the larger, later, spoils.

    Now this is the major key in terms of the premier league because most business people only get one small window of opportunity to make them into elite business people who can play on the bigger stage as time goes on.

    John Hall and co managed to see a massive opportunity to set themselves right up into the mammoth scale of the football elite, because, at the time there was very little rivalry.
    Basically few clubs could compete with the borrowing they went into and the outlay they were prepared to gamble on with Keegan and co.

    From that point on the big guns had entered the fray and the Halls were left high and dry and leaving Shepherd and co to soldier on and chancing the clubs very existence on whim after whim.

    In terms of where this club was at the time of Ashley taking over, think of it like the man tied to the post as the firing squad were just about to pull their triggers….or the condemned man standing on the trap door as the hangman is about to pull the lever.

    Now here’s the real statistics, if you can actually call it that.
    We are in the premier league nearly 11 years after the Halls ran away and left the club in the hands of someone who was desperate to own such a fantastic club and work it in unison with his other business interests and also fell for the sucker punch of being forced into the immediate buy WITHOUT DUE DILIGENCE because he was told about a Moroccan consortium who were ready to do a deal after they done due diligence.

    Naive Ashley just went for it and then realised just how dire the situation was…..his own fault but still……he took it all on the chin.

    The major issue and I mean this wholeheartedly. The major issue for Ashley was in appointing Keegan and it wouldn’t surprise me if the Halls coaxed him into that….but that’s speculation as is all we can all do.

    The very same Mike Ashley should be thanked in truth.
    Yeah, railroad him for his mistakes but remember that some of his mistakes might not have been mistakes if the bile and hatred spewed at him wasn’t at fever pitch, simply because Keegan spat out his dummy.

    AGAIN.

    The rest is as we saw it but no way in hell am I going to place this club down as any demise under his ownership.
    If anything he saved this club from a fate that is now becoming of Sunderland.

    • Cockneytrev

      What utter rubbish!!!!
      If he wanted success for the club and saved it, why has the commercial side of the club stood still, while every other premier club moved forward, also the due diligence line he has trotted out had been proved as a lie, he set up NUFCdirect, six months before his purchase.
      At the beginning of Ashley’s tenure of my club, I thought he was honest and wanted to move us forward, it quickly became obvious that he was only using us as a FREE advertising tool for his retail company,,
      As for us doing a Leeds, Sunderland etc this is all speculation as it DID NOT HAPPEN, deal in facts as the article does!!!
      I still find it incredulous that people like yourself and 2 or 3 others who post on this site can still see no wrong in Ashley, but I believe you and them are either Macams, work for Ashley or are Trolls,,,

    • hetonmag

      What a load of claptrap this club would never have folded under Shepherd,the debt is even worse under Ashley after 10 years of asset stripping like free advertising and selling your best player’s, it doesn’t matter how you and your other Ashley mate’s dress his ten years up, he and he alone has single handedly destroyed the hopes of thousands of fans at a time when there’s more money in the game than their ever was under F.S.

    • osmosis

      There are no words….

    • Dillon Tovak

      Keegan didn’t “spit his dummy out”, it’s proven in court he was lied to. Cynically.
      And the due diligence issue, completely his fault, he shouldn’t be so reckless. So that’s a mistake he and he alone should take on the chin and is an irrelevant point forever more.

      • Kneebotherm8

        We’ve only got “honest”Mike Ashley’s word that he didn’t do due diligence.
        Bollox as far as I’m concerned,he’s not averse to telling a porkie or two.

      • Guest 2

        Due diligence is a smokescreen. Like he couldn’t establish that the club had a mortgage and overdraft etc?
        Or the recent revelation that he registered an NUFC website 6 months before the purchase?

        • Kneebotherm8

          He’s not that naive not to have done due diligence,sick of hearing the Ashley apologists on here defending him with that line.
          As you say he was preparing for the purchase of this club months before he bought it,and it was not a knee jerk,last minute purchase as he’s tried to make out in the past.
          We’d have to be as naive,as he’s trying to make himself out to be,to believe that one.

    • FatParosite

      More miopia…. Yawn

    • Paul Patterson

      At no point in the history of Ashley’s ownership has he ever made a decent effort at putting Shephard/Halls and more importantly HIS OWN mistakes right. Hiring a competent MD to replace a decent man in Chris Mort would have been a start.
      Mistake after mistake after mistake after mistake after mistake after mistake, followed by disaster has ensued and there is only one person to blame for that.
      The ‘Woe is me’ and ‘I was suckered into this mess’ can’t wash 11 years down the line.

      • ghostrider

        Granted we’re not in a position the fans want. I want more but we could easily be getting a hell of a lot less.

        • TheFatController

          How? PCP want the club and clearly intend to invest and make changes to restore us to being a regular PL club through sensible investment and salaries paid for by tv revenues and commercial revenues maximising the potential of the fan base that is bigger than many of the teams above us can draw on.

          What part of that strategy is ‘less’ than we have now?

          • ghostrider

            If that’s their ultimate goal then I’m all for it.
            Do you know this for certain and if so tell me how you know.

  • justchampion

    My god there are still Ashley apologists out there.

    • Leazes

      I think its all the same guy.

      • Rich Lawson

        It would go some way to explaining why no takeover deal has been done yet.

    • MadMag83

      Clarko IS Mike Ashley’s PR team.

      • TheFatController

        Doesn’t he just enjoy being adversarial?

        Mind you, that would be the job description for the role of Ashley’s PR, so you may be right!

      • Kneebotherm8

        Hopefully when/if Ashley departs then he follows him with one or two other apologists on this site.

  • Clarko

    What a poor article. You’ve just listed the finishes over the last 16 years.

    “So what’s the point of churning out statistics like this?”

    😂

    • Cockneytrev

      He listed the exact number of finishes prior to Ashley taking over so therefore like for like,, which was the whole point of this article,,,
      What he should have added was our cup performances under Ashley and those prior to his tenure,,

      • Clarko

        “He listed the exact number of finishes prior to Ashley taking over so therefore like for like,, which was the whole point of this article”

        Can you tell me where I said anything to the contrary in my initial comment?

        The article is poor, “here are the finishes before Ashley and here are the finishes after Ashley, Ashley bad”. No reasoning, no analysis, no depth and very pointless. It’s just a list of league finishes.

        • Cockneytrev

          You said over the last 16 years,,
          What did you expect, the last 125 years?
          The league finishes while Ashley hasn’t been the owner and the exact prior to him taking over,,
          I’ve read your posts and you like to try and prove your point by stats,, this is exactly what the author of this article has done,,

          • Clarko

            I said over the last 16 years because he listed the finishes over the last 16 years… What’s wrong with you?

            These are not statistics, this is just a list of leagues finishes. Again, no analysis, no reasoning, no depth and no point.

          • TheFatController

            I’m not sure why poor performance needs analysis?

            The list in the article simply points out that Ashley has taken the club backwards based on football results (which dictate league position).

            They say ‘better to be a lucky manager than a good one’, well it seems Ashley is neither a good nor a lucky owner, based on the ultimate statistic for judging a football club, where they finish in the league…

            No analysis needed therefore – he’s neither good nor lucky.

          • Clarko

            “I’m not sure why poor performance needs analysis?” I’m sure, they do.

            “The list in the article simply points out that Ashley has taken the club backwards based on football results”. No, the list points out that Newcastle have a lower average league position in the previous 11 seasons when compared to the average league position of the 15 seasons beforehand.

            Analysis is needed.

          • TheFatController

            Ok, facts might help:-

            – Managers that the owner was reluctant to sack have done nothing since (Carver, kinnear, Pardew, MacLaren), whilst hughton, Keegan, Shearer and Rafa get a mix of lies, disrespect and general disdain. This is not behaviour conducive to success on the field

            – whilst all other PL clubs have broken their transfer record regularly as a result of the tv revenue inflation, we haven’t broken ours in Ashley’s 11 years, despite sales of £35m, £30m and £20m going out.

            – whilst other clubs have maximised revenues off the pitch, we have seen a reduction. You don’t need to invest anything to increase revenues outside of investing in people capable of doing the job to a professional standard. Clearly, and knowingly, we haven’t made such a simple, comparatively low investment.

            And although I could go on, we all know the many other policies and tactics that have been negative, but near this in mind. An owner of a club is morally only it’s custodian. If you’re not wanted then morally you are obliged, if not being put out of pocket, to give up custody. As owner, you’re not a God. You’re only playing at it.

          • Clarko

            “Ok, facts might help”, yes, they would’ve helped, in the article, which was my point.

            I am not interested in debating whether Ashley has been a good, bad or average owner as I have done quite a bit of that (with you) and it is usually met with ignorance, like in this case, the “facts” you’ve listed are not “facts” at all, they’re largely made up, incorrect and opinion based.

          • TheFatController

            Made up? Nice assertion, with no demonstration.

            I’m never writing primarily in reply to to you, I’m just always enjoying the banter of my fellow commenters on here in ridiculing the ‘legend’ that is Clarko and your bizarre denial about Ashley and his actions/ motives.

            Your regular trick seem to be to make out Ashley bailed the club out with his money, without him we’d be in financial peril.

            That denies the likely reality that someone would come in and buy the debt and then run the club to maximise potential rather than gamble on the chance of minimum investment giving PL survival.

            Even as we speak, PCP are negotiating to pay Ashley nearly £300m to wipe out the debt, meaning Ashley isn’t the only pony in town capable of ‘saving the club from financial meltdown’.

            But nice try. Next…

          • Clarko

            No demonstration?

            The turnover before his takeover in 06/07 was £87.1m, the turnover in 15/16 was £125.8m. Meaning the turnover has increased by 44%.

            John Carver lasted 94 days after he became head coach. McClaren lasted 196 days after he was appointed as head coach. Kinnear lasted 174 days as manager before his contract was allowed to expire. Benitez has been in charge for 461 days currently… What were you saying about Ashley being “reluctant” to get rid of some managers?

            It’s true that Newcastle have not broken their transfer record since 2005, but that record still beats that of 6 current PL sides. You mention fees mention fees of “£35m, £30m and £20m going out”, the net spend since 07/08 season, up until now is €74.88m, meaning that money has been spent.

            I don’t know where the talk of Ashley being the “only pony in town capable of ‘saving the club from financial meltdown’” comes from? It appears to be made up. But nice try. Next…

          • TheFatController

            Turnover is related to a deal made by the PL club meaning all clubs get it of in PL. thus any owner would see the same increase in revenue, it’s not driven by Ashkey’s management of the club. But nice try.

            MacLaren should have gone in January yet took the club away for a training camp and lost to Chelsea and Bournemouth straight after. Carver should never have been appointed as he wasn’t qualified, and Kinnear had been out of football too long and should never have been employed.

            You point out yourself that turnover is up in their period (as I have stated earlier due to market forces and not good stewardship) yet we only have £75m net on transfers over 10 seasons, despite higher turnover and 3 players sold for £80m profit?

            PCP are buying the club. And removing the debt. What part of that do you not get when I say ‘Ashley isn’t the only person capable or willing to save us from the debt the club has amassed?’ How hard can it be to realise that if you have two people capable of clearing the debt. That means Ashley, being just one, is not the only one. 2 less 1 is 1. That remaining one is PCP.

            You really do make my day with your personality disorder, but it must be no fun for anyone left in your non-cyber life…

          • Clarko

            All opinion based, not factual, as previously stated:
            “MacLaren should have gone in January yet took the club away for a training camp and lost to Chelsea and Bournemouth straight after. Carver should never have been appointed as he wasn’t qualified, and Kinnear had been out of football too long and should never have been employed.”

            “You point out yourself that turnover is up in their period (as I have stated earlier due to market forces and not good stewardship) yet we only have £75m net on transfers over 10 seasons, despite higher turnover and 3 players sold for £80m profit?” Yes. (Side note, you haven’t suggested any missed revenue that was down to bad “stewardship” and why)

            “What part of that do you not get when I say ‘Ashley isn’t the only person capable or willing to save us from the debt the club has amassed?’” The part where you suggested that I said that ” Ashley isn’t the only pony in town capable of ‘saving the club from financial meltdown’”.

          • TheFatController

            If I could be bothered, I’d enhance my opinion of you as showing signs of personality disorder with evidence, but I doubt anyone else reading this bar you would be needing any evidence, their opinion probably matches mine …

          • Clarko

            And there we go, an opening paragraph “insult” and two following paragraphs, that are completely unrelated to the previous comment, that end in questions.

            Remember when I said this earlier:
            “I am not interested in debating whether Ashley has been a good, bad or average owner as I have done quite a bit of that (with you) and it is usually met with ignorance (with you)”

            My point proven. Again.

            Have fun 👍🏿

          • Guest 2

            And less commercial and merchandising revenue. And greater debt. And loss of club assets.
            If it looks like the brown stuff, smells like the brown stuff, then it’s most likely brown stuff.
            There’s no further analysis needed to confirm the point being made.

          • Clarko

            Again, ignorance.

            My whole argument is that “commercial and merchandising revenue”, “greater debt” and “loss of club assets” weren’t mentioned in this article, it was just league finishes, you have made my argument for me, that’s how ignorant you are.

          • Guest 2

            Sure. Go ahead then and show us all how smart you are. Provide the statistical analysis that proves the outcome of the argument made by the poster is wrong.
            Prove to us the club is better off, rather than worse, due to Ashley;s ownership. Otherwise stop pontificating with meaningless argumentative drivel.

          • Albert Stubbins

            We as Newcastle supporters are mostly ignorant. Of course I can’t speak for tens of thousands of fellow supporters but the facts are that thousands of us blindly follow the team despite the shyte we’ve had to put up with owners and directors for generations. If that’s not ignorance I don’t know what is. Most of us and I’m assuming this again, don’t read the financial times or the Lancet. We’re normal everyday folk who just happen to love our football. You can analyse everything you like, produce as many figures as you like,create as many charts and graphs case you like but the bottom line is this. Most of us understand the implication that before Ashley things weren’t great but they were pretty good and during Ashley’s tenure things have got a whole lot worse. This article sums up most people’s interpretation of that fairly conclusively in my humble opinion and I’m guessing thousands of others. Some things don’t really need that much analysis.

          • Clarko

            “Most of us understand the implication that before Ashley things weren’t great but they were pretty good and during Ashley’s tenure things have got a whole lot worse”. Which is exactly my problem with dross like this, correlation does not imply causation.

            “Some things don’t really need that much analysis”. People don’t tend to question something they already believe in.

          • Cockneytrev

            Ok
            I’ll analyse it for the writer of the article,,
            During Ashley’s tenure, he has systematically undermined any kind of success on the pitch by selling any player with even a mediocum of talent and refusing to replace them with like for lIke, also he has surrounded himself with sycophant hoop lickers, because of this our league position in the time that Ashley has been the owner has been Year on year worse than those years prior to him taking over,
            If you can’t see this or refuse to see this then you need to start watching American Football a sport that is awash for statistics.

          • Clarko

            The whole point of this “discussion” was that the article was poor because it lacked analysis, reasoning, depth and a point. You (poorly) analysing Ashley’s reign doesn’t make the article better.

          • Cockneytrev

            And you you could analyse it better?
            I didn’t go into any depth as it’s plain for the normal human to see what is blatantly obvious therefore doesn’t have to be analysed to death.
            Mine was a simple synopsis of Ashley’s very poor tenure in charge,, but if you get your jollies out of slating my analysis and anyone else on this site with whom you disagree, your a very very sad man
            Incidentally your one of the hoop lickers I was referring to,,

          • Clarko

            There we go, you have nothing of substance to say and have had to resort to name calling. And I’m the “sad” one.

            Incidentally, you don’t know the difference between your and you’re.

          • Cockneytrev

            I know you’re a hoop licker,,

            Incidentally your the one who started being defamatory,,
            And I did have something of substance to say but you prefer to ignore it ,, as your one Ashley’s hoop lickers!!!! 👅

          • Clarko

            Still doesn’t know the difference between you’re and your…

            Have fun 👍🏿

          • Cockneytrev

            you’re a hoop licker👅

          • Cockneytrev

            Happy you hoop licker👅

          • GToon

            I’m sat at home in bits laughing at your comment. I always try and avoid saying owt like that but sometimes it’s just too funny not to.
            What he failed to grasp is that I said at the start that I wouldn’t go on about the whys but just give the facts in the same way a top businessman would present Ashley with the league positions and then say he’s fired. I really just can’t see any good that’s come of his time in charge. The league position is ultimately the way of identifying that fact.

        • Toonrobbybobson

          The number tells you… its worse performing.

          • Clarko

            They don’t tell you why.

          • Guest 2

            A one eyed frog could tell you why – and you would still argue.

      • Paul Patterson

        I remember when we were fighting it out in the cups and in the Champions League. Often this was while we were battling at the top end of the league. Under Ashley, even mediocrity seems to be a struggle.

    • HTL

      He has listed the finishes since the inception of the premier league (which just so happens to be 26 years), I believe the point of publishing the statistics is to show how our club has diminished as a footballing entity in the last 10 years (which is the period Mr Ashley has owned the club).
      With Mr Ashley having complete control and micro-managing the clubs affairs it shows there is a link between the downturn in footballing stature/performance and Mr Ashley’s ownership.
      HTL

      • Clarko

        Correlation does not imply causation. Which is why it’s a poor article, “here are the finishes before Ashley and here are the finishes after Ashley, Ashley bad”. No reasoning, no analysis, no depth and very pointless. It’s just a list of league finishes.

        • HTL

          But it is the league placing that measures the sporting performance of a professional football club, and by using this metric it shows that under Mr Ashley’s tenure the club has been performing at a lower sporting level than the clubs average for the entirety of the premier league.
          I am not trying to imply causation, just simply pointing out the fact that we have underperformed as a sporting team during the period of Mr Ashley’s ownership.

          • Clarko

            I never said that you were trying to imply causation, I said the article did.

            I never stated anything of the contrary to what you have just written, but like the article the only content in your comment regards to league finishes (without implying causation). Your comment, the one I’m directly replying to, is not wrong or stupid, it’s just pointless. The article is wrong, stupid and pointless.

          • 8prestondave

            Its called having an opinion and being allowed to put it out there for discussion without someone calling someone stupid, ignorant, pointless or wrong.

          • Clarko

            I did discuss it, guess what the conclusion was? That it was wrong, stupid and pointless.

            Unless you can tell me why this article isn’t wrong, stupid and pointless any comment you make is pointless to this discussion.

          • 8prestondave

            And therein lies the real issue. The whole point of posting stuff is to create debate and conversation especially when the writer believes he has a valid point to make. Peple like you who are happy to call people ignorant because they disagree with you end up being the talking point rather than the article. You try and come across as some kind of statistical know it all yet the minute you are challenged you go on the attack. So telling me I’m pointless to this discussion seems rather childish because you would end up on your own forum talking to yourself if others weren’t allowed to participate. For someone who comes across as “intelligent” you can be a bit of a fool sometimes.

          • Clarko

            The writer didn’t have a valid point, as proven.

            I call people ignorant, when they are being ignorant, just like you are being by ignoring the ignorance of Guest 2, who wasn’t disagreeing with me, but trying to argue about a whole different topic because they were not reading what they were responding to, on top of that they were misrepresenting/misremembering/lying about previous conversations, which they also failed to acknowledge when asked for a quote, that didn’t exist.

            Again, your comment was pointless, you have still yet to contribute to the actual discussion. All you are doing is whinging about me pointing out when someone is wrong, stupid or pointless instead of actually telling me why they aren’t wrong, stupid and pointless.

        • Guest 2

          Well, reasoning and analysis is clearly absent from your head. Do explain to us how his outcome is wrong – and why.
          Under Ashley’s ownership this club has gone backwards in every area.

          • Clarko

            I did, you just ignored it:

            “Correlation does not imply causation, which is why it’s a poor article, ‘here are the finishes before Ashley and here are the finishes after Ashley, Ashley bad’. No reasoning, no analysis, no depth and very pointless. It’s just a list of league finishes.”

          • Guest 2

            Is the outcome wrong? No, it isn’t. But you just can’t admit as always. Come on, supply some statistical analysis then and provide a different outcome.
            You just love your own keyboard.

          • Clarko

            What would be the point? As you have demonstrated today and in previous “discussions”, I would give you “statistical analysis” and you would ignore it.

            You’re unwilling to be wrong and you are unwilling to change your opinion, so again, what would be the point?

          • Guest 2

            Fella, if you believe you have an argument which proves the club is in a better position with Ashley as an owner, then you are just proving what we all know about you.
            Deluded and utterly absent from reality.

          • Clarko

            And for the third time today, ignorance.

            Can you quote me where I have stated that, “the club is in a better position with Ashley as an owner”? I’ll wait.

          • Guest 2

            Not ignorance. You just argue for the sake of it – regardless of the actual point being made.
            The construct of the argument does not detract from it’s objective outcome.
            Now go flush your head down the bog.

          • Clarko

            And there we go, no quote. You made it all up in your head, meaning you are the one who is trying “to argue for the sake of it”, not me.

            Dummy.

          • hetonmag

            He can spew out as many stats as he wants about Ashley but the stat we as fans look at is 2 relegations and 3 near misses in his 10 lousy years ownership.

        • Kneebotherm8

          Before and after………………very valid I would say.
          The article is only pointless in that it tells me and everyone else what we already knew……our premier league performances have dipped markedly since Ashley took over………

          • Clarko

            “The article is only pointless in that it tells me and everyone else what we already knew……our premier league performances have dipped markedly since Ashley took over………”

            Exactly my point, very silly, pointless article.

          • Kneebotherm8

            Not your point at all,you’re one of the few who don’t see Ashley as having lowered our expectations/achievements /ambition at all in the premier league era.

          • Clarko

            No it was my point.

            Me:
            “No reasoning, no analysis, no depth and very pointless. It’s just a list of league finishes.”

            You:
            “The article is only pointless in that it tells me and everyone else what we already knew”

          • Kneebotherm8

            When I said “what we already knew” the “we” bit didn’t include you.
            You always quote your facts & figures in defence of Ashley.
            These facts in the article are pointless to the likes of me because I know where Ashley has taken us since arriving at the club.
            They’re not pointless to the likes of you,though,they’re just an annoyingly irksome reminder to you of where we’ve been taken under his ownership.
            That’s the reason you’ve even responded to the article in the way you have.

          • Clarko

            Dude, we agreed, the article was “pointless”, get over it.

          • MancToon

            You’re pointless.

            Get over it

          • Clarko

            “Everyone wants people they like to be right, that’s why popular people are f*****g dumb”

          • MancToon

            You interpreted my comment as that?

            Firstly, I know no one on here so don’t “like” them to “want” them to be right.

            Secondly, I’m guessing no one has ever told you tho, but when the rest of the world is wrong, and only you are right, it’s actually the opposite..

          • Clarko

            When the “rest of the world” can’t tell you why you’re wrong, they’re wrong.

          • MancToon

            I believe you’ll find you’re being proven very wrong.

            Fighting fire with fire springs to mind with you.

          • Clarko

            You shouldn’t have trouble quoting it then, the conversation, and explaining how I’m wrong. I’ll wait.

          • Kneebotherm8

            We agreed on fck all,buddy.

          • Clarko

            Whatever helps you sleep at night, buddy.

          • Kneebotherm8

            Ok we’re agreed then,dude?

        • GToon

          I think you will find the Ashley out website and campaign provide the necessary depth and analysis but to put it in simple terms he has perused an agenda of short term gain at every available opportunity to our detriment and long term pain. Visit the ground, watch the team. He hasn’t improved either.

          • Clarko

            It’s funny, I wasn’t criticising the Ashley out website, I was criticising your article, this article, it’s poor.

    • GToon

      It’s a quick and easy way to point out what an abject failure Ashley is as our owner and how we have gone backwards under his tenure. I was prompted to write the article as I don’t go to many home games. It had been three years since my last game and I felt like a former home owner who goes into their home after selling it and wonders what improvements have been made. In Ashley’s case, none.

      • Clarko

        “It’s a quick and easy way to point out what an abject failure Ashley is”. Well you failed in doing so with this article, you simply listed the Premier League finishes.

        The rest of you comment has nothing to do with your article or my comment.

  • Leazes

    Spookily we have the fifteenth placed squad in terms of overall valuation at the moment….. that means a relegation scrap was planned.

    For ten years before Ashley parked his ample a$$, the Deloitte report had us placed in the top 20 most va£uable clubs, I think we once were fifth after a bout of Champions league football…. Fatty has taken us to ‘thirty-sixth’…… and rapidly disappearing over the horizon.

    Its what he does…. buys a brand and cheapens the product, he does it with everything…..

    ….He’s like Trump…. a great big kid.

    Why do you think the Chairman hides from public view? Why did Ashley put a wall of silence around his operation?

    Why don’t the local press demand Charnley answer a few chosen questions?

    Charnley lives in Gosforth (recently switched houses) he can’t be hard to find for a journalist…. why hasn’t the London and Manchester press corp got someone camped on his doorstep?

    …. do the press give a hoot?….. they’re happy to regurgitate ‘five things we learned’ or ‘United fans respond’…. the questions have been there for over ten years, but the press haven’t.

    In the words of Delia…’C’MON LETS BE HAVIN YER’

    • Paul Patterson

      In the 90’s the media would follow Freddy Shepherd and other Directors around for quotes and soundbites all the time, especially at the height of the infamous sex scandal of 1998 and the ‘Mary Poppins’/Shirt rip off/’Newcastle women are dogs’ fall out.
      In this day and age, journalists are lazy. In the absence of quotes and facts, the copy is all just made up rubbish . .

      • Peter

        To be fair, part of the problem is that the useless tax-avoiding owners of most of the mainstream press have cut staffing to the bone. A lot of ‘journalism’ these days consists of little more than cutting and pasting stories from elsewhere, with no checking or confirmations…

        • Toonrobbybobson

          Its like a desert full of mirages

        • Leazes

          tax-avoiders I hate those guys.

        • Toonrobbybobson

          Which suits their agendas to peddle fake tripe and make people sheep.

        • Oooh bobbi fleckman

          As everyone with a blog is a journalist now, there is not much point in paying staff, furthermore, if readers aren’t paying for newspaper & advertising has dived, there is little incentive to invest in journalism.

      • Toonrobbybobson

        No such thing as journalism and anything in the nationals they are told what to say by agenda.

      • East Durham Mag

        Its more fictional than factual now. The old quip that we are all deluded and expect the Premiership and Champions league trophies are trotted out ad nauseum. Fatty and his minions only talk to preferred Hacks who will happily swallow the lies and untruths that he and his men perpetuate. FFS Fatty just sell up and go.

      • Kneebotherm8

        Lazy fake news………..that’s all we’re fed…..

    • Rich Lawson

      Injurous speculation sells more papers than the truth.

    • Kneebotherm8

      I thought Charnley was mute……….he can speak can he?………..have you got any evidence to support that?

      • Leazes

        Actually no…. he’s never been on camera.

        • hetonmag

          He’s had his photo taken in custody does that count ??

    • Guest 2

      Not hard for anyone to find him. Pay a couple of quid and do an electoral roll check.

    • Oooh bobbi fleckman

      The wealth of the club was a sham, the club was insolvent you fool

  • Steve

    Interesting stats that just backs up even further the clubs demise under the inglorious mike ashley. How the pundits think we should be grateful for this I’ll never know.

  • 1957

    For me the decline started with the sacking of SBR and Sourface arriving. Ashley has simply continued our fall by not addressing some of the fundamental problems we’ve had for years, poor recruitment, poor coaching staff at all levels and most damming for me no credible policy in respect of the development of young players.

    • Toonrobbybobson

      We have always been bad at long term planning. To sort Newcastle out is a longer term problem. Not just the first team but the levels underneath have been badly handled.

      But yes since SBR left we have been in decline overall. He was the only manager (not including Rafa as not supported by club) to actually improve us at Prem level in a sustained manner. If only he had come in sooner straight after KK.

      • Paul Patterson

        Imagine taking over a side consisting of Shearer, Ferdinand, Asprilla, Gillespie, Ginola, Lee, Albert, Beardsley, Batty, etc?
        It’s immense credit to SBR that he built that up again five years later, from scratch (minus Shearer).
        Imagine how much it would cost to buy that side NOW?

        • Guest 2

          SBR had Shearer in his team, what you on about?

          • hetonmag

            Yep 5 goals in the 8-0 hammering of Sheff Wed.

          • Paul Patterson

            Hence the ‘Minus Shearer’ part . .

      • Kneebotherm8

        If only…………..

      • Guest 2

        So you don’t count KK’s time as sustainable progression? From the verge of Div 3 to the top of the PL and European football – and stayed there for 5 years. Agree otherwise though that had SBR arrived when KK departed then things would have been a whole lot different.

        • Toonrobbybobson

          We didnt we ended up with KD who was a different kind of manager and different mentality for team same with Gullit. KK also got rid of the reserves. We have always been too quick to change with the wind. I really hope the takeover happens so Rafa can stay and build us a legacy at all levels. Halls/shepherd were just interested in what was fashionable at the time but at least they had interest unlike Jabba.

  • Mrkgw

    The day that Ashley and his sidekick, Charnley ship out will be a day that none of us will ever forget and will celebrate for many years to come. As I have said before, John Hall gave us many unforgettable memories with KK and SBR at the helm. By contrast he did however, sell in haste to the worst owner in the history of the club. For that, he gets no thanks.

    • Andy Mac

      Indeed. If the Robber Baron and his group of greedy opportunists hadn’t stripped the club bare we may have had bids from reputable suitors. The ones that came, had a look at the books, didn’t hang around long enough to make a bid.

      • Guest 2

        That’s the Ashley garbage you are spouting. The club had a 47 million mortgage / overdraft and fees outstanding for players. Exactly the same situation as other clubs. Now the club ‘owes’ 144 million, to Ashley, instead.

        • Oooh bobbi fleckman

          You seem to be ignoring the other £65m of debt and how the losses were to be financed?

          • TheFatController

            Well, he bought the club. I don’t have any shares, nor any input in the club’s running. How am I supposed to be grateful to Ashley that he puts money into his own investment?

            You seem to be making the mistake that the club debt is the fan’s debt? So if the club makes a profit Ashley would share it with us?

            Stop trying to make us the guilty party and Ashley the saviour. That’s victim status deflection used by most persecutors in the history of the world.

          • Oooh bobbi fleckman

            Ashley is not the saviour but also not the villain. The mistakes were made before Ashley arrived, Ashley’s mistake was the money he paid for the shares. Had he not been so hasty, he could have picked up the club for nothing and simply paid the debt. If he did that, he’d have got the club for £129m plus a notional amount for the shares and then been a hero for buying some new players.

        • Andy Mac

          Yup the mortgage on the stadium had to be paid off on change of ownership however all the Northern Rock sponsor money had gone way before the agreement ended plus there was outstanding payments for half a dozen players who had been bought by them. Let’s not forget they had hocked so much of the club’s assets that even the banks wouldnt give them credit on favourable terms.

          There is no doubt if they hadnt scraped every last drop out of the club NUFC would have been a far better prospect to a potential buyer rather than a fire sale specialist !

      • Oooh bobbi fleckman

        That is right, the club was financially in the clarts and all the suitors decided they didn’t fancy us.

  • Albert Stubbins

    I never forget the day lambeeeeezze was interviewed on talksport asking him why they weren’t considering pardews position in light of going ten games without a win and some crushing home defeats. In his usual patronising tone he simply replied, you don’t understand what were trying to do here do you? And that about summed up the whole rotten lot of them for me. Clueless, jumped up condescending prats way out of their depths playing at being football people and ruining people’s lives and the club we all love with total and utter disregard.

    • hetonmag

      What other MD would run naked across the pitch they just bring the whole club down to there level.

  • East Durham Mag

    GToon mate the main thing which has progressed nicely is Fattys bank balance at the cost of any progression of the club. The Fatty apologists will disagree no doubt.

    • Paul Patterson

      That’s a point many people overlook. This club has gone alarmingly backwards over ten years, while Ashley has benefited from free advertising and his wealth has increased.
      I’m not bothered about him becoming richer, but at the expense of NUFC?
      He can sod off!

      • Guest 2

        And the Gallowgate club land for his own development.

    • Oooh bobbi fleckman

      How has his bank account progressed? It’s cost him, he’s had to put more money up when we’ve been relegated.

      • hetonmag

        Well he should have put a team in place not to get relegated then.

      • TheFatController

        “Investors please beware, the value of investments may go down as well as up’

        Please tell me we’re supposed to be grateful Ashley’s lost money on his investment gets covered by….er, who, oh! By him….

        I was about to write a cheque for him, didn’t realise he’d suffered and no doubt that’s down to us, not him. A more deserving case for our financial support than food banks, I think we can all agree?

      • Kneebotherm8

        In the form of a repayable loan…….

        • Oooh bobbi fleckman

          Which has not made him any richer. If I lend you £100 without interest in 100 quid worse off until you pay me back when I’m at best, in the same place as before the loan.

          • Kneebotherm8

            Not any poorer either……………

          • Oooh bobbi fleckman

            Well, he has £144m less in his bank so until it’s repaid, yes he’s worse off.

          • Kneebotherm8

            Couldn’t be an accounting tax move could it?……for his Mash holdings.

            Quote/unquote

            When ‘Group Structure’ is talked about by Ashley and his employees at Newcastle United, it is this ‘MASH Holdings’ that they are referring to, where the Newcastle United owner has grouped together the football club and his brands/shareholdings. The reason for having that debt inside Newcastle United is because for business reasons it suits Mike Ashley, not any kind of goodness of his heart towards our club or the fans.

          • Oooh bobbi fleckman

            I’m not a tax accountant so I’m not aware of such a loophole, maybe you can explain?

          • Kneebotherm8

            Company year end profits are taxable are they not? a loan to nufc would offset that profit for tax purposes.
            Mike,as the article states,has debt within NUFC for business reasons mainly, it’s of benefit to Mash holdings to lend that money to NUFC.
            It is not any kind of goodness of his heart from him to the club,or us the fans,as the article states.

          • Oooh bobbi fleckman

            As i say, I’m not a tax accountant so enlighten me. From my basic understanding, Interest free debt on nufc’s books does not effect profit so there is no tax saving for Mash.

            Nufc needed that money, if they went to the bank, interest is charged so that would reduce profits so less tax is paid if they financed externally.

            Until last December, all the debt was a personal loan from Mike Ashley to Nufc, not a Mash company. From last December, the split us now £33m At James holdings £111m from Mike Ashley. That may have been gone strategically but nevertheless, it was an increase in the lending that was required in order for the company to remain solvent.

            The only tax advantage in the loan is that when Mike Ashley’s loan is repaid, he gets it back tax free but it would be madness to put the money in via any other means, he paid tax on his personal wealth in the first place so he’s not going to structure the finance in a way to pay tax twice.

            Please explain this great tax ruse.

          • Oooh bobbi fleckman

            Are you still working out your explanation?

      • East Durham Mag

        Shows him to be the chancer that he is. Our relegation woes are his fault. Poor management and scouting system, buy players to sell on for massive profit if they perform ripping the team to shreds for profit. Doubtless you don’t agree but thats your perogative.

        • Oooh bobbi fleckman

          I disagree in that players were sold because they wanted to leave. It’s how that money was reinvested that was the problem.

          • East Durham Mag

            I can see your point about player’s wanting to leave. Perhaps they could see what was coming or no effort was made to persuade them to stay. Either way its agreed there are definate questions over the reinvestment or lack of it.

          • Oooh bobbi fleckman

            The one where the wheels fell off was Cabaye, in his case, we did everything right but for the choice of replacement. He was told he could not go in the summer but could once we had a replacement. The problem was that we believed Carr was a genius in scouting, the truth was we’d seen most of his best work.

      • Paul Janes

        Both relegations were financed by player sales

        • Oooh bobbi fleckman

          No they weren’t

  • Rich Lawson

    He doesn’t care about the club or rely on it for his living,it’s a handy cash cow for a trip down the casino.The only thing that might hurry his exit is an empty park.47,000 on Saturday for a 3rd round tie with 2nd division opposition,it’s not happening,no disrespect to those who choose to protest by not attending but I and alot of others can’t do it,I want to be there and with that sort of gate I don’t understand why no one will pay the quoted £300k,suck up a few debts and get on with making this club great again ?

    • Clarko

      “2nd division opposition”, “£300k” and “doesn’t care about the club”.

      Wow.

  • Andy Mac

    Actually GToon it was time for the Fatman to go after 4 managers in one season followed by relegation. That showed how poorly the club had been run in the past and, with the exception of Rafa, it hasn’t ever improved.
    We’ve the potential to be a top European club but we’re run on a shoestring, a cheap shoddy one at that.

    • Leazes

      When was Charnley last seen?

      • Damon Horner

        Not sure if he has been seen to the public since he was handcuffed by HMRC?

      • Albert Stubbins

        Burning paperwork in his back garden!!

        • Kneebotherm8

          November 5th,he had a big bonfire……….

          • Albert Stubbins

            He should have done the decent thing and re inacted the role of guy Fawkes!!

          • Kneebotherm8

            😂😂😂😂😂

  • robbersdog

    The doomsday scenario: The takeover doesn’t happen, we get relegated and Rafa walks out.

    If Newcastle fans have to take one more bite of Ashley’s relegation-themed sh*t sandwich, I can foresee civil unrest in Newcastle; things could get nasty.

  • GToon

    I should have explained why I took a look at the last 26 years but I assumed everyone on here would work that out – the start of the premier league. All but one of us realized! The point behind the article is that I don’t go to many home games so I like to see what’s new, what’s changed. Or to put it another way if I had been asleep for the last ten years and woke up in Mike Ashley’s company and I asked him what he had done, what improvements had he made, what would he say?

    • Kneebotherm8

      Yes I’m one of the vast majority that knew what you were on about,Clarko is in his own little universe where Ashley is God and any mutterings of discontent must be answered by the he who knows it all.

      • GToon

        But what I don’t get is that he clearly supports the club and he has decent knowledge about our past. I’m guessing he is over 40 so I would think he would view Ashley’s tenure like the rest of us. I wish I could view it in a different way other than a massive missed opportunity.

        • Kneebotherm8

          I think he’s about 20 and he knows nothing but the Ashley era and just before.
          Living through the Hall/Keegan era was surreal as we challenged at the very,very top of the premier league and I just don’t think he gets it due to the fact he never experienced it.
          If you’re correct about his age and he did experience those years then it makes it all the more puzzling for me.

  • GToon

    Dear Clarko I would like to submit a challenge to you. I’ve had my go if you like, I’ve put my thoughts online to be shot at and I would like you to do the same. I’d love to see your summary of Ashley’s tenure in an article. Please use as many statistics as you like to prove he’s been a success. Over to you mate.
    Glyn

    • Clarko

      I post my thoughts regularly on this platform, feel free to take a shot at them and any statistics that accompany my thoughts. I’ve never called Ashley “a success”. Over to you.

  • HarryHype59

    Clarko and the other dull witted Ashley sychophants, never acknowledge that Ashley has owned the club during the most lucrative era in top flight English football.

    Hundreds of millions have poured into the club coffers via the TV cash. The club has basically been a “golden goose” for the owner.

    • Clarko

      The club has spent €421.37m on players since he took over, with a net spend of €74.88m. That’s pretty respectable considering these “hundreds of millions” have only been around a few seasons and don’t forget in that time Newcastle were relegated, after spending €108.26m, with a highly paid, “world class” manager in charge.

      But hey, who cares, Ashley, terrible owner, am I right?

      • Cockneytrev

        No your a hoop licker 👅

        • Clarko

          *you’re

          • Cockneytrev

            Hoop licker 👅

          • Clarko

            Yeah, if I didn’t know the difference between your and you’re I would just avoid using it as well.

            😂

          • Cockneytrev

            Hoop licker 👅

          • GToon

            Lmfao!

          • Geordiegiants

            You love that one Clarko don’t you? 👍

        • Kneebotherm8

          He suffers from rickets………..his head has been where the sun don’t shine for a very very long time………………..right up Ashleys backside…….

      • GToon

        Yes. He is a terrible owner. He has even admitted as much himself when he said it was up for sale. Britain’s poorest billionaire who can’t make a success out of one of the best supported clubs in the world never mind the country.

      • Kneebotherm8

        Yeah Ashley is a terrible owner and no,Steve McLaren is not a world class manager.

      • Albert Stubbins

        What about his appointments? What about the change of name of our beloved stadium. What about Denis wise? What about how he treat and was found to be a lier in court by king keV? The list is endless. Yes he’s put a few quid into his club the same way I spend money on my car when it’s about to blow up. So what. The man’s a bl oody vulture.

        • Clarko

          And there we go, the typical Newcastle fan. “So what if we’ve spent €421.37m, he tried to change the stadium name” (so we could spend more money)…

          😂

          • Down Under Mag

            Money spent isn’t the real issue, it’s net spend and failure to replace outgoing players who have been sold on for massive profits, not to mention ludicrous appointments such as Wise and Kinnear that did nothing to improve on or off field issues.

            The stadium name change would have been pittance in the big picture so even if it would have gone to paying for one player it was a massive P.R. blunder at a time the club were struggling due to the owners own mistakes in how to run the club.

            The clubs profits have gone backwards and there in lies the problem. I have no issue with the club being self sufficient, but when it is burdened with an owner intent on giving his own company free advertising and lack of any business accumen on the global front beyond short term financial success then he needs to invest some of his own money to make up the shortfall. I honestly believe the club is more a vehicle for SD advertising and there is my othe rtheory in that I doubt th etakeover is real I think Ashley just wants the club back in the limelight to get some free publicity. If he wanted to sell then he would have already. If he wanted to ensure the clubs future then he would invest. With neither on the agenda at the moment then there is only one logical explanation and that is he is taking the fans and the club for another of his joyrides into the media circus for his own personal gain.

          • Clarko

            If you read my initial comment you would see that Newcastle have a €74.88m net spend, so any comments about selling players for massive profits (saying like it’s a bad thing) and not reinvesting that money is just not true.

            The stadium naming rights were sold to Wonga, they just opted to revert it back to St James’ Park, a deal which was worth £24m, I wouldn’t call that a “pittance”. It was the reaction of our fans that generated the negative P.R. changes to stadium names is common in football and are generally accepted.

            “The clubs profits have gone backwards and there in lies the problem”. That is not true, Ashley made the club profitable, £9.9m in 2013, £18.7m in 2014, £32.4m in 2015 and £4.6m in 2016. The turnover before his takeover in 06/07 was £87.1m, the turnover in 15/16 was £125.8m. Meaning the turnover has increased by 44%.

          • Down Under Mag

            I’m not irrationally bashing Ashley here, but quoting stats doesn’t cover the underlying concerns unfortunately, it’s not so much a case of just looking at spending but HOW that money was spent.

            The spending was done in an “aquire a lot of cheap players and hope some get sold at a massive profit” philosophy. All this has done is lumber the club with an awful lot of players who are simply not good enough while seeing anyone who does make the grade sold on for said profit and replaced by more low cost players of questionable quality. This has led to a slide in overall quality at the club as we see those good enough go out the door and failed to be replaced by adequate quality. All clubs sell. Southampton are a selling club but they also buy in quality replacements not gambles on future profit.

            Also, the clubs turnover in terms of raw numbers means nothing unless you look at it in context of footballs overall finances. We have reduced outgoing costs markedly at the expense of on field strength, but the overall income from football is increasing so it is unsurprsign that we are still maintainign profitability. However, we have failed to keep pace with even the most mediocre of teams in the Premiership, gone are the days of us competing in the top 20 richest list and the only reason we still maintain some resemblance of european money list appearances is more to do with the money of the Premiership as a whole rather than our own financial clout. Sadly, we should be doing substantially better than we are.

            The ground renaming I personally think was a dig at teh fans and the history of the club. It is one thing getting naming rights to a newly built stadium but you don’t see Liverpool or Man Utd renaming their grounds and I am sure that they would command huge amounts for it. The money for the ground renaming is also an issue of priority…we sell the name of the ground but offer SD free advertising so lose out on that potential revenue stream?? It’s just a very cloudy issue. yes certain sections of the fanbase over-reacted on a number of occasions, but football is about passion and Ashley needs to understand that.

          • Clarko

            Quoting stats, that I calculated and sourced proves your points to be incorrect, it’s evidence, it’s factual, something which you haven’t used.

            We signed “awful” “cheap” players…. until we didn’t and signed players like Cabaye, Ba, Tiote, Sissoko, Remy, Wijnaldum, Darlow, Lascelles, Townsend, Ben Arfa, Debuchy, Janmaat, Gouffran, Santon, Elliot and Perez. That philosophy was successful until it wasn’t (the relegation season) and we’ve since binned that philosophy in favour of the one we have now, the “Benitez” philosophy.

            Your “financial” argument, is again, completely made up, outgoing costs haven’t been reduced, for example the wage bill, in 06/07 before Ashley took over, was £59.8m, in 15/16 it was £74.7m, meaning since his arrival, wages have increased by 25%. In 15/16 we had the 10th best revenue in the Premier League, not bad for a club that finished in 18th and the 2017 Deloitte placed Newcastle as the 21st richest club in the world. Again, you’re just wrong.

            “The ground renaming I personally think was a dig at the fans and the history of the club”. Well it’s a good job it doesn’t matter what you believe, what matters is what actually happened and why, the reasoning behind the name change (that didn’t happen) was positive, money for transfers.

            You’re massively uninformed.

          • Down Under Mag

            Lies, damned lies and statistics as the saying goes… It’s evidence but some of it is contexutally out of place.

            You cannot look at overall numbers financially for NUFC compared to other European clubs without taking into account the fact we are propped up by the richest league in the world. Also claiming that we should be comparing total wages from 06/07 to the current financial climate is naive at best. Personally I appreciate that a more sensible approach was taken on the finances…I just wish it were in a more sustainable model.

            Also, I agree…those were some good players, what we would all give for a few of that list you named here now eh? Although a success? Maybe a stetch given we’ve had 2 relegations since Ashley took over and are well and truly entrenched in another…something certainly hasn’t gone right with his plans.

          • Clarko

            No, I can look at the overall numbers for NUFC compared to other European clubs, you know why? Because you stated “gone are the days of us competing in the top 20 richest list”, and you were wrong, just like you were when you stated that the clubs profits had gone “backwards” and just like you were when you stated that we have “reduced outgoing costs”. You’re uninformed, you don’t know what you’re talking about.

            “Also claiming that we should be comparing total wages from 06/07 to the current financial climate is naive”. No it’s not, you stated that Newcastle had “reduced outgoing costs”, that is “naive” and you were wrong. This is common in your comments, you make a stupid, “naive” statement, I provide the numbers that prove you wrong and then you try to backtrack. No.

            There is another example of your backtracking, you stated that the old transfer philosophy left us with “awful” “cheap” players, I provide a list of “good players” and suddenly you change the argument to “what we would all give for a few of that list”. Again, no. Lets address that you were wrong about the old transfer philosophy leaving us with “awful” “cheap” players.

          • Albert Stubbins

            Imagine if he’d appointed decent managers before Rafa and given the money to buy decent players. Then we’d all have cause to like him. That’s not Ashley’s fault I hear you cry. Who’s fault is it then? He only spends money when it looks like the club is in real danger of going down and his failure to invest at the right time has consistently got the club in the shyte. Cheap tickets is a result of clever marketing and the fact that due to broadcaster revenue the amounts charged at the turnstile are becoming less and less important in terms of financing the club. Most clubs are doing it now in the top tier. I thank him for it all the same as it allows Me and my son to witness the shyte that has been served up over the last decade. Thanks for that Mike.

          • Clarko

            And there we go. He can do no right, you’re biased, uninformed and unwilling to change your opinion.

            If he spends money he’s panicking, if he doesn’t he’s failing to invest.

            If the increases the ticket prices he’s greedy, if he lowers the prices it’s a scheme.

            If he hires a good manager so what? He hired a bad one 10 years ago.

            It’s embarrassing, and fans wonder where on Earth the “deluded Geordie” label comes from. Have fun blindly hating Ashley 👍🏿

          • Albert Stubbins

            I don’t blindly hate anyone. I don’t think I even mentioned the word hate. If I did you’ll be able to quote me somewhere I’m sure. I have simply said that under his tenure the club has been in my opinion been ran terribly and he could have invested these large chunks of money your keen on reminding us all far better than he has. How much has he wasted on the likes of kineer, wise, lambeezzee, keegan court cases etc etc. On that basis his running of our club has been a disaster. No hate here my friend just anger and frustration. Have a nice day.

          • Clarko

            I never said that you did say that you hate Ashley, I said that you hate Ashley, there’s a difference.

            Again, it’s pointless to argue, you’re unwilling to change your mind.

          • Albert Stubbins

            So your assuming I hate Ashley although you accept I’ve never said it? Imagine someone drawing that implication from some of the things you’ve Said over the last few months. So you must therefore love Ashley even though you haven’t actually said ir. Can we the reader infer that then from your recent comments?silly statement. Hate is a strong word. I think it’s fair for you to deduce from my comments that I would far prefer a serious alternative to Ashley. What would you like? To continue as we are and hope that Ashley backs benitez to give us a fighting chance? It’s never going to happen.

          • Clarko

            Yes, I’m assuming you hate Ashley.

            “Imagine someone drawing that implication from some of the things you’ve Said over the last few months. So you must therefore love Ashley even though you haven’t actually said it”. Happens daily.

            “I think it’s fair for you to deduce from my comments that I would far prefer a serious alternative to Ashley”. Hey look, my assumption is justified.

            “What would you like?” I would like people to look at the current ownership and his actions in a non biased, informed, objective viewpoint.

          • Albert Stubbins

            Your assumption is wrong, , i try to understand him and thats why i dont hate him, i just think hes made or been badly advised by people who arnt football people but people he has trusted in other business dealings. he himself has gone on record to admit hes made some bad football related decisions and wishes he hadnt got involved in the first place. Whether he is telling the truth about his involvement we will perhaps never know. You cannot hate something or someone you dont know or understand, I am confused and frustrated as are most fans- they use the word hate as its simple to use in my opinion.

          • Clarko

            “Yes he’s put a few quid into his club the same way I spend money on my car when it’s about to blow up. So what. The man’s a bl oody vulture.”

            “He only spends money when it looks like the club is in real danger of going down and his failure to invest at the right time has consistently got the club in the shyte”

            “Cheap tickets is a result of clever marketing”

            “I thank him for it all the same as it allows Me and my son to witness the shyte that has been served up over the last decade. Thanks for that Mike”

            “Yes he’s put a few quid into his club the same way I spend money on my car when it’s about to blow up”

            Yeah, you don’t hate him at all, you’re always trying to “understand him”. Like I stated earlier, he can do no right, you’re biased, uninformed and unwilling to change your opinion.

          • Albert Stubbins

            where have i ever said i hate him? you’re drawing lots of conclusions but not any facts that you are so fond of quoting. He is a vulture- vultures prey on the misfortune of others- ashley has exploited the fans love of the club and we have let him ride roughshod over us as a result. he has exploited this situation to his own advantage- hence the term vulture. The car comparison is also valid i feel. feel free to keep looking for examples where i use the term hate for ashley- i have has much hate for him as I do you. stick to quoting figures clarko, you’re good at that.

          • Clarko

            And you’re good at ignoring those figures.

            I don’t care if you say that you don’t hate Ashley, I don’t care if you do hate Ashley, I am not trying to prove you hate Ashley. I am trying to provide the correct information about Ashley’s tenure as owner and you’re ignoring that information, I don’t care that you’re ignoring that information, you ignoring that information doesn’t make me look ignorant, stupid and biased, it makes you look ignorant, stupid and biased. If that’s how you want to come across, that’s on you, fortunately for you, you’re in good company on this platform.

            I’m out, have fun at the “Ashley is a bl oody vulture” club.

          • Albert Stubbins

            you’re a bright lad clarko no one is denying that but you are no expert on mike ashley.

          • Oooh bobbi fleckman

            He bought a club that was a financial basket case heading for administration. Yes, he should have done his homework but where would that have left us?

          • Oooh bobbi fleckman

            Wow, a club that allows it’s tickets to be affordable because it has a good TV deal….that’s a bad thing? Come off it.

          • Albert Stubbins

            I was being sarcastic but yes I am grateful for that one thing he has done.

          • Kneebotherm8

            “breached”

    • Duh

      Personally I don’t have an issue with the level of investment in the club and I am not sure it has been that lucrative to mikey. Lots of money has clearly been spunked on transfers, high wages, payoffs (e.g. Keegan and Allardyce) and agents fees.

      My issue is how badly the club has been run. Poor management appointments, adopting a dumb ass strategy of buy players low and sell high irrespective of what is needed on the playing side and then a long list of stupid transactional things many of which are as a result of having a week managing director who is probably not empowered.

      As a result, poor management and decision making has meant lost revenue through the likes of relegation, general lack of success, not selling shirts in China etc

      Even the likes of Alex Ferguson had his hits and misses in the transfer market but many of ours “misses” were inexcusable and a complete waste of money.

    • Oooh bobbi fleckman

      So why have so few clubs made a profit in this era?

  • Oooh bobbi fleckman

    Your stats are a bit selective. From 1960 up to the premier league era, Nufc spent 18 out of 31 years outside the top division. Take the previous 30 years, we were also out of the top league for 13 of those 30. If you recall correctly, we weren’t even in the premier league when it was formed. Under Mike Ashley we’ve been out of the top division for 2 out of 11 years, given that he took over a club that was likely to be relegated in 2007/8 as we’d have had a 10point deduction for going into administration and unlikely to recover quickly, it’s a positive that we have Been in the top league for so long..

    The reality is that previously, we’ve only been relegated so few times is because we never managed to get promoted.

    • Somerset Toon

      A) what are you talking about? When did we get a points deduction?

      B) the argument is how many times we’ve been relegated. This is regardless of what division we were in. We could have been relegated to the old Third Division a few times and this would have been factored in to the stats. But we weren’t so it wasn’t.

      • Oooh bobbi fleckman

        We didn’t go into administration as we had a change of ownership and he pumped money in to avoid sanction.

        Yes, the author says we’ve been relegated twice but the real point is how long we spend outside the top division, MA has out performed other owners in our history.

        • Somerset Toon

          That’s fair enough, the previous regime mismanaged our finances horrendously. However, I still don’t agree that MA has outperformed all previous owners.

          Financially he’s done better but with very little reinvested in the club and us being relegated twice and never doing very well in the league or cups, how can he be viewed as anything but a failure?

          • Oooh bobbi fleckman

            There are lots of things to moan about with Mike Ashley, his timing of investment is one of those but I think we need to keep things relevent. My question is if it were your money / children’s inheritance would you have blown it on an ego trip or been closer to the MA model.

            The problem really is he stopped enjoying it when Kk left and then ran it exactly like a business. Sometimes, football clubs need to be ran in a businesslike way, sometimes they need the owner to honour on a limb. MA is a numbers guy, he dies not go out on a limb unless the figures match up.